possible newbie

[pininfarinna_marcus]

hi all,

 

possibly might be owning my first Jag in the next month.

I've been looking at S types as the value has now dropped. it'll be my weekend car as i have a vectra for the daily commute and a Jeep as the family wagon, plus as my mgf has been neglected for the past few years and is currently being stripped to fund my next purchase - as per the instructions from the fun prevention officer - 'no more cars unless one goes' on top of that im now in my 30's and a suitable age to own one (he says)

 

So, question is 3.0 or 4.0??

 

MPG is neither here nor there as it'll be used sparingly - an R is outta the question as i only wanna spend up to 3K and i don't do high milers. So, which one to go for??

 

Thanks in advance

[Old Peter]

Hi Marcus, and welcome to the club.

 

The s type is a very good car and if you are looking for a Petrol fueled car both the 3 litre and 2.5litre engines are pretty good.  Both were made by Ford and are well tried and tested.

 

The 2.5V6 was more or less discontinued about 2005 by the introduction of the 2.7 Diesel .

 

You can get a good s Type for quite a cheap price and if the bodywork has been looked after and the car is quite clean you will get a bargain.

 

Boy racers never went for Jaguars as they felt that they were for older people, but the older people who did own them also were good at looking after them.

 

Good luck.

 

Regards,

 

Peter.

[Guest]

Hello Marcus,

 

Have a rethink and buy a diesel 2.7 and enjoy it daily as your every day car. I'm biased of course as that's the one I have but i love it, sounds great as it's still a V6, goes like a train and over 30 to the gallon, nearly 40 on a long trip. Mine has the aluminium dash instead of old fashioned wood and cream leather looks a bit more modern.

[Old Peter]

I have a 2.7 diesel and I think it is great and on a long run I get over 45 mpg.

 

But if you are just having a car for the weekend and not doing long runs there could be EGR and DPF issues [you need to give the car a good run and a bit of a blast every now and then].

 

But with £3k to spend and not wanting a high mileage car I assume that something pre 2004 is being looked for and the 2.7D only appeared in 2004.

 

It will be an interesting quest to find the right car, but there are a few around.

 

Meanwhile, enjoy the search.

 

Regards,

 

Peter.

[pininfarinna_marcus]

Hi,

thanks for the replies. Yes ive been looking at pre 2004 cars and hadn't thought much about a diesel. Like i said this car is just going to be for me for drivers enjoyment and the occasional posh do that we may attend. Having owned an MG in the past im not too bad with a socket set, spanner or hammer.

After selling my Volvo T5 last year for something more economical - hence the vectra - im kinda missing the power and luxury that it provided.

[Old Peter]

I did have a quick look on Auto Trader for S types under £3k and with less than 60k on the clock. There were about 6 or 7 and priced around £2k.

 

I didn't look at diesels because they would be a touch more expensive, and the ones that were not would be high mileage.  Diesels were only fitted to Jaguar s types in 2004 - the Gemini 2.7 Diesel engine.

 

Peter.

[knightsmith]

Marcus,

 

I would look into diesels very carefully before you buy one . They look like they are going to be the governments next "cash cow" due to the nitrogen oxide they pump into the atmosphere . due to reports like this (not they they need much excuse).

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-18415532

 

ATB,

 

Trevor

[mk1escortmad]

Diesels have peaked they cant make the engines any more efficient to meet new emission rules hence why manufacturers have started to concentrate and invest on petrol engines again. That said cant see why an older diesel shouldnt be considered. But you may save in fuel with a diesel but repairs can be more costly

[Old Peter]

That is a good point, Martin.

 

The engines that are being made by Jaguar in Wolvehampton will be the latest design and will start with smaller petrol and diesel engines - 2litre 4 cylinders.

 

The 2.7 diesel in my S type meets the Euro 4 requirements, but Brussels will keep on trying to reduce emissions and are still in a quandary as to what can be done with the older diesels powering 'buses and lorries.

 

Idea by some governments across Europe of having more low emission zones is not particular feasible and I think will prove, if implemented a complete failure.

 

Peter.

[knightsmith]

Peter,

 

In what way will it be a failure ? I don't think people will be given any choice, and will have to lump it same as the other congestion charges . They are already talking about doubling the congestion charges for diesels entering London .

 

My friend is a nurse for Macmillan nurses on the Isle of Wight, and she said it is staggering the amount of coach and lorry drivers she sees in with cancer, but has a theory vibration plays a part as well .

 

The World Health Organisation have published papers proving that diesel fumes do cause cancer , and rightly or wrongly, this is the excuse the government will use .

 

ATB,

 

Trevor

[Old Peter]

Hi Trevor,

 

There are loads of statistics,  and the difficulty of zoning vehicle entry into an area makes the idea unworkable.

 

Buses and coaches are a big problem as many of them were on the road prior to the Euro emissions initiative.  The latest Gemini diesel meets euro 4 targets, whereas the big diesels that are on the roads do not have the DPF and from the visible fume trail on many appear not to have EGR valves either.

 

Worldwide air pollution figures look so much at vehicles and put low down on the list the pollution from many manufacturing plants.

 

The aluminium now being used by Jaguar is all recycled material, and the lightness and rust free attributes of the material makes it easy to get the same engine performance in a car from a smaller and less polluting engine.  However there will come a time when there is not enough scrap aluminium in the world and there will have to be a return to either steel or the smelting of aluminium ore [bauxite] which is a terribly polluting process.  The two Aluminium Melting shops in the UK closed down years ago.

 

There are so many quandaries and the EU committees are notorious for taking a long time to reach decisions. [i was a member of several EU committees.]  Often the problem has gone away before the decision was reached.

 

There is much rook for a very wide discussion.

 

Regards,

 

Peter.

[knightsmith]

Peter.

 

The WHO and Diesel fumes are not a statistic, it is a proven fact , but each to their own. Personally I cannot stand the smell of the stuff . And the EGF and DPF valves seem to be more trouble than they're worth, and must be very offputting

 

Look on the bright side, at least you haven't got to put up with twenty odd of those windmill things like we have down here in the sticks, or those awful solar farms springing up everywhere.

 

ATB,

 

Trevor

 

P.S. I don't do Europe. I'm firmly a real tea, cuff links , feet and inches, and a Fahrenheit man .

[pininfarinna_marcus]

Hi guys,

thanks for the comments and information. Too be honest i can't say ive looked at diesel's plus, id have to do a number of miles to make it worth while surely? if i only did 1-3k miles a year surely i wouldn't see much of a benefit?

[Old Peter]

Hi Marcus,

 

I do about 6500 miles a year and the saving in road  fund licence of £200 is worth having, plus the fact that I get a much better mpf.  However, I have a model that was in the last run of cars coming off the line.  Cars within your budget would be the very early diesels with q 

ite a high mileage.

 

Peter.

[pininfarinna_marcus]

thanks Pete,

yes i agree. i know its not a huge amount of money to spend, but it is just to be a weekend car, i hadn't looked at a diesel only cos i think they're out of my price range and out of certain criteria.

I realise that ill be looking at an early s type, hopefully a pampered example. I think the main question i face though is a v6 or a v8??

They're seem to be alot of 3.0 v6's and not so many v8's for sale

[mk1escortmad]

The 3.0 is the same lump that was used in the mondeo ST but flipped round for the rwd jag.

An awful lot of mondeo ST's have suffered from catastrophic big end failure but doesnt seem to be as common in Jaguars so can only put that down to the more 'enthusiastic' driving of sporty ford drivers!

Mines done 110k and runs as sweet as new oils always golden and I always change Oil once a year or every 10k whatever comes first.

service history is the main thing to go for rather have a high milege car with a folder of receipts than a low milage car with very little.

[Old Peter]

Hi Marcus, [& Martin],

 

There are not many 4.2V8s around as the 3.0 litre was the best seller between 1999 and 2004,  and were mainly sold to people who wanted the classic Jaguar style.  They were also never a company car [ the Mondeo was ],and generally did not get much hammer like sales reps give their cars.  A friend of mine had the 2.5 V6 version and that was not a bad car either, and you could find a good example, although personally I would go for the 3.0 litre.

 

Regards,

 

Peter.

[Mike_eng]

V8

[pininfarinna_marcus]

V8

So what's it like owning a v8 ??

running cost, spares, driving enjoyment, noise etc.....

[knightsmith]

Marcus,

 

There is nothing quite as satisfying as the burble from a V8 as you're driving slowly through a town.

 

ATB,

 

Trevor

[Mike_eng]

Best bits: Noise, sounds fantastic, it's either silent or full chat V8 howl

                Power, 60 in just over 6 seconds makes it as fast or faster than most newer cars and it was still pulling hard at 150 in Germany last year

                Handling is superb for such a big car, mountain passes near Stresa in Italy were a barrel of laughs

                Surprisingly good on fuel 32 on a long run to Italy 4 up and I get 27 to 28 on average

                The engine has been faultless over the last 20,000 miles

 

Bad bits: It does go through tyres every 12-15000 miles but what do expect with 300hp?

               Several expensive visits to Nene Jags, aircon computer, all radiators replaced etc but that could have happened to any S-type

               If you don't like autos there isn't a manual option

 

Whether you go for the 3.0 or 4.2 make sure that if do buy an auto it's the six speed ZF, I've driven both and the later 'box is light years ahead of the older Ford unit.

 

Hope that helps,

[pininfarinna_marcus]

Best bits: Noise, sounds fantastic, it's either silent or full chat V8 howl

                Power, 60 in just over 6 seconds makes it as fast or faster than most newer cars and it was still pulling hard at 150 in Germany last year

                Handling is superb for such a big car, mountain passes near Stresa in Italy were a barrel of laughs

                Surprisingly good on fuel 32 on a long run to Italy 4 up and I get 27 to 28 on average

                The engine has been faultless over the last 20,000 miles

 

Bad bits: It does go through tyres every 12-15000 miles but what do expect with 300hp?

               Several expensive visits to Nene Jags, aircon computer, all radiators replaced etc but that could have happened to any S-type

               If you don't like autos there isn't a manual option

 

Whether you go for the 3.0 or 4.2 make sure that if do buy an auto it's the six speed ZF, I've driven both and the later 'box is light years ahead of the older Ford unit.

 

Hope that helps,

thanks for the reply Mike,

I think the 4.0 is the preference. I've always wanted a big V8, but assumed id always end up buying a big yank tank.

I have found one in a garage that i bought my Jeep from, within budget. but it says silver but im sure from the pictures its sea frost paintwork. ( i think thats right )

[Mike_eng]

Hi again Marcus,

 

I really would recommend driving the one with the 4.2 before you make your mind up.

 

The 4.2 had a couple of major fixes over the 4.0 including cylinders that didn't go porous and a cam chain guide that didn't break.

 

Also you get the ZF 6 speed box, I know I'm going on about it but there really is a world of difference.