New member from Palm Springs, CA

MiragePro · January 16, 2018

I have a 2002 XK8, which I am enjoying driving around with the top down in sunny California.

Rooster210 · January 17, 2018

2 hours ago, MiragePro said:

I have a 2002 XK8, which I am enjoying driving around with the top down in sunny California.

Im glad you have sun i have snow in my yard in Georgia. Welcome to the board

Old Peter · January 17, 2018

Welcome to the Club, Wayne.

Nice to see more club members from the USA. There does seem to be a special relationship with Jaguar and drivers at the other side of the herring pond, and in the warm climate of some of the States, it must be great to drive with the roof down when half the country is covered in snow.

It snowed here last night.

Meanwhile enjoy your. We make good cars in Brummagem [ Birmingham].

Regards,

Peter.

Carole Simpson-Hadley · January 17, 2018

Good morning Wayne (or should it be "good middle of the night" where you are?!)

That's a fine looking XK8, improved by the fact that you don't, unlike us, have to display a front licence (license) plate. Is that a second/third car or your daily driver? We think our XK X150 coupe would look better without the licence plate but don't think Officer Dibble aka Traffic Policeman would approve.

MOH (my other half) recalls a couple of visits to Palm Springs some years ago.......has a particular recollection of wandering the streets (Liberace was still in residence at Casa del Liberace at the time) and spotting Mr Kirk Douglas enjoying a drive out in his Cord roadster......very nice (the Cord, that is!). He also recalls having a very interesting conversation with a proud Kenworth Conventional truck owner at Desert Center en route to Phoenix, at the time travelling in a rental AMC Concorde (remember those?!). Also discovered that going up into the hills via the cable car didn't reduce the UV effects of the sun.......result, some cracking shoulder blisters. Adjourn for snacks at Sambo's, which probably isn't there anymore!

Enjoy the XK which we are sure doesn't go out in the rain, primarily because you don't get a lot! Our XK is likewise, even though we DO get a lot of the wet stuff. Thank goodness for Carcoon.

Happy growling

MiragePro · January 17, 2018

Dan, Peter, & Carole, Thanks for the cold welcome. Would have said warm but it appears you're all in a frozen state.

Dan, It appears you are getting some pretty cold winter storms in Georgia this year. Happy time for the 4-wheelers and not so much for Jags.

Peter, Brummagem? First time I have heard that term. Is it slang or have a hidden meaning?

Carole, Palm Springs has it's advantages during the winter. It's averaging 80F here now. During the summer it averages 118F. Way too hot to drive in a convertible. During the summer it stays garaged. I take it out about once or twice a month for a quick spin and it's back in the garage.

I have had this car going on two years and have only put on 300 miles. The top stays down all time, I do raise and lower it about once a month. Afraid of the dreadful green shower, so use it sparingly. Spent last summer replacing all the plastic parts on the engine, and next summer will do the suspension.

Have always been a fan of British cars, with the exception of Lucas. When Thatcher was PM, she should have declared Lucas a national disaster. Might have helped save the British auto Industry.

Old Peter · January 17, 2018

Hi Wayne,

I worked in the Steel Industry almost all my working life, and from Lancashire to North Wales, to Sheffield and finally to the West Midlands where I remained after I retired, I got to know many of the different accents and indeed dialects. I now live in a small town called Sutton Coldfield which became part of Birmingham. Most of my working time was spent in the Black Country, an area where they made steel, were iron founders, and created more smoke than the rest of England. The accent/dialect of the Black Country turned Birmingham into Brummagem, Toys R Us [the Toy chain] into Toys Am We and many more.

And Lucas --- I could spend hours telling you about Lucas.

We are in the middle of a very cold spell here at the moment but know that the daffodils will be out soon!

Regards,

Peter.

MiragePro · January 17, 2018

1 hour ago, R2e said:

Actually, having worked for a Lucas dealer in the late 1960's (yes I am that old!), I find this demonisation of Lucas undeserved. Until the malaise and militant unionsism that hit UK manufacturing generally in the 1970s (and with much thanks to Jeremy Corbyn who wants to bring it all back), they were a !Removed! good and innovative company. Lucas in my opinion, were it not for the bloodymindedness of the unions, would have become the British Bosch. And yes, before you start thinking I have right wing credentials, the management were atrocious. But it is all, like the Comet and technology like the jet engine passed on FOC to the US, missed opportunity. Excuse me while I have a little weep........

Ron, I restored and owned on a lot of British cars during the 70's. An E-type, Austin Healey 3000, Sunbeam Alpine and Tiger. Besides keeping those multiple carbs in sync spent a lot of time working on the electrics. I am familiar with the militant unionsism during that time. It's sad it put an end to a rich period of British history. Jeremy Clarkson did a great piece on it, "Clarkson's Car Years - Who Killed The British Motor Industry? Here is a link if you haven't seen it.

Rooster210 · January 17, 2018

3 hours ago, MiragePro said:

Dan, Peter, & Carole, Thanks for the cold welcome. Would have said warm but it appears you're all in a frozen state.

Dan, It appears you are getting some pretty cold winter storms in Georgia this year. Happy time for the 4-wheelers and not so much for Jags.

Peter, Brummagem? First time I have heard that term. Is it slang or have a hidden meaning?

Carole, Palm Springs has it's advantages during the winter. It's averaging 80F here now. During the summer it averages 118F. Way too hot to drive in a convertible. During the summer it stays garaged. I take it out about once or twice a month for a quick spin and it's back in the garage.

I have had this car going on two years and have only put on 300 miles. The top stays down all time, I do raise and lower it about once a month. Afraid of the dreadful green shower, so use it sparingly. Spent last summer replacing all the plastic parts on the engine, and next summer will do the suspension.

Have always been a fan of British cars, with the exception of Lucas. When Thatcher was PM, she should have declared Lucas a national disaster. Might have helped save the British auto Industry.

Yeah I moved to Georgia in may of last year thinking yay no more snow Im sick if cold. The first snow storm which was around christmas we built a snow man that was about 6 feet tall and the biggest of the pieces was over 3 feet thick. He was in the yard for about 5 days. Now its about 2 or 3 inches of Ice in the yard and our temp high was about 19* F today.

But hey 65 predicted for Sunday. Hopefully I can get the parts I need to fix my shifting issue before it drops back to the high 40s for wednesday

MiragePro · January 17, 2018

2 hours ago, Old Peter said:

Hi Wayne,

I worked in the Steel Industry almost all my working life, and from Lancashire to North Wales, to Sheffield and finally to the West Midlands where I remained after I retired, I got to know many of the different accents and indeed dialects. I now live in a small town called Sutton Coldfield which became part of Birmingham. Most of my working time was spent in the Black Country, an area where they made steel, were iron founders, and created more smoke than the rest of England. The accent/dialect of the Black Country turned Birmingham into Brummagem, Toys R Us [the Toy chain] into Toys Am We and many more.

And Lucas --- I could spend hours telling you about Lucas.

We are in the middle of a very cold spell here at the moment but know that the daffodils will be out soon!

Regards,

Peter.

I was thinking it should be Burrrrrrrrmingham.

Old Peter · January 18, 2018

10 hours ago, R2e said:

Actually, having worked for a Lucas dealer in the late 1960's (yes I am that old!), I find this demonisation of Lucas undeserved. Until the malaise and militant unionsism that hit UK manufacturing generally in the 1970s , they were a !Removed! good and innovative company. Lucas in my opinion, were it not for the bloodymindedness of the unions, would have become the British Bosch. And yes, before you start thinking I have right wing credentials, the management were atrocious. But it is all, like the Comet and technology like the jet engine passed on FOC to the US, missed opportunity. Excuse me while I have a little weep........

Lucas could have been a top company had there been a desire to get that place. They had a unique play in the British auto industry until the management decided to put making money before making electrical components. A part that cost £1 to supply would cost about £8 if there was a recall by the Auto Manufacturers because of a faulty part. Quality began to get worse and not better, and those who remember the Auto Industry in the sixties will remember electrical failing in cars.

And I will make a point about "the Unions" which should be "those two or three unions in the auto industry" - Most of the Trade Union Movement, including the TUC were aghast at the lack of leadership in some of the unions -- "Let the Lads decide" when an argument arose. The Shop Stewards -- just a small group really with too much power were pandered to by a management that were living the life of luxury, chauffeur driven company cars, wine with lunch served by liveried butlers are just two examples. It was John Egan in th eighties when he took over Jaguar Cars that started to actually talk directly to the workforce.

I will also make another point and I am not defending the Unions in the Car Industry. When the Japanese Car Makers in Swindon, Washington, and latterly Derbyshire built factories they had the same unions to work in those factories, but a different management.

The car industry in the UK were once the second largest in the World after the USA, and by far the largest in Europe. When the Management started to make money rather than cars, the workforce followed suit. The demise of car making in the UK started from the top.

This might appear a bit of a rant, but it is something I researched very thoroughly. If you read John Egan's book "Saving Jaguar" plus another book not yet published "The Cars that Saved Jaguar" you will understand.

Peter.

Old Peter · January 18, 2018

Hi Ron,

I was quite involved with the parts manufacturers, and mostly in the Black Country. They were all members of a Trade Union, and never had a dispute that involved a strike, due to their Full Time Officers who led rather than "Let the Lads Decide".

I have visited practically all of the car plants [except Jaguar, strangely] in the UK, and saw their operations. All efficient and well managed. I also visited the Kremlin, as the offices at Longbridge were called, finding the the Shop Stewards had their own big office across the corridor from the Board Room,with their own receptionist.

I also met Red Robbo, with whom I was not impressed. It took the courage of Pat Lowrie to sack him for something trivial, and Robinson would have won a tribunal, but chose to have a mass meeting to call for a strike. When he found that the workforce was against him, he realised that was then end of his "job" at Longbridge. things settled down when the rather astute and reasonable jack Adams took over his job and declared peace. Jack Went on to become Deputy General Secretary of the TGWU.

But all too late for the British Auto Industry.

I did have a Toyota Avensis as a company car in 1998,and found it not too desirable, with little power and garish and poor trim. I did write to Toyota, and the 2000 model was re-engined, and the upholster and trim was improved, so much so that SWMBO now drives a Toyota!

Regards,

Peter.

MiragePro · January 18, 2018

The 70's were not too kind to the American manufactures either. They went through a lot of the same tensions and situations as in the UK. In 1974 the U.S. government put a lot of new safety and smog regulations into effect which effected both sides of the pond. In 1974 I traded my Mercury Capri in for a brand new Mustang II. The Capri was an excellent car. The Mustang was a piece of junk. Transmission went out 6 times, and during the last visit to the shop I was told It was actually a Ford Pinto with a Mustang body. I traded it in for a Toyota, and the was the last American car I purchased. Chrysler came out with their "K" cars and they were also crap. You could drive by a Ford dealership and watch the lot boys re-glue the trim on the sides of the cars as they were peeling away. There was a lot of conflict between the Unions and Management as well. My daily drivers are now either Japanese or European. Japanese cars have that quality and dependability you can rely on, but are boring. That is why I love Jags, exciting to drive, but not my daily driver. Seriously thinking about an F-type.

Carole Simpson-Hadley · January 18, 2018

Interesting reading, Wayne. Without wanting to get embroiled in the Lucas was/wasn't rubbish, Unions were wonderful/were rubbish and similar arguments, MOH does recall that on his many visits to the US in the '80s and '90s, the home produced offerings (sometimes rental, sometimes other) were pretty dire........for example, AMC Concorde straight 6 (wouldn't pull your hat off), Olds Cutlass V6 (similarly gutless and falling apart quite rapidly), various Chevy Blazers and a very unmemorable Chrysler Grand Voyager (oh very dear with that one!). Even a temporarily purchased (and almost new) Trans Am didn't cut it.....must have been watching too many Smokey & The Bandit movies.

The mileage which you cover (or, rather, don't cover) in your XK8 is amazing. We thought we were on the low side with our XK X150....an '07 purchased in April 2016 which has, even now, only covered 9500 miles from new. Just on 1K miles since the last vehicle test which is due in 3 weeks. That's an average of just 860 miles per year.

Quite understand your comment about it being way too hot to drive a convertible with the top down on the edge of the Mojave Desert in summer......a good recipe for heat stroke, not to mention cracked leather?!

We haven't been tempted by the F-type with its various appendages; we prefer the clean lines of the original Ian Callum X150 which looks best with the 20" wheels as you will see in the attached pic. We also love our '07 S-type SE whilst our '98 XJ8 X308 (just 65K miles from new) is our "fettling" project....you could say that, like yourself, we have been bitten by the Jag bug. We did, at one stage, contemplate a XJS but values on those are in take-off and there are a lot of cars of debatable history and condition but silly price; they seem to be becoming considered as the next rising star following on from the E-type. That said, each to his own and, as said elsewhere, if its your car you will enjoy it.

We both hope that you continue to enjoy the XK8 and get a great deal of pleasure from your fettling exercises.

As always, happy growling!

MiragePro · January 18, 2018

Carole, you have some high quality pedigree in your stable. I have enjoyed this whole thread with all the input from members who have lived and worked through the British auto industry. Very educational.

Another Jag I would love to own is the XJ6 or 12. Unfortunately my garage will hold only 3 cars. We recently totaled our Volvo C30, our daily driver, and are going down to a Jag dealer in San Diego to look at a Volvo C30 Polstar. My wife is a big Volvo fan and they only imported 250 of these and are numbered. I am hoping I can talk her out of it and convince her that the F-type would be more exciting, or at least maybe a F-Pace.

I would have to thank Jay Leno for getting bitten by the Jag bug. Every time he shows a new Jag segment on his YouTube channel, I have to grab a roll of paper towels to clean up all the drool. Guess I am going to have to get a bigger garage.

Carole Simpson-Hadley · January 18, 2018

Yep, the storage problem is always there. Our XK lives in a Carcoon within a large garage, so is, effectively, in a controlled environment. However she is put away, she comes out exactly the same. No condensation or moisture (even if she goes in damp, which is unlikely, she dries out courtesy of the filtered air circulation and venting system), no dust and no bugs etc.

Unfortunately, the S and the XJ have to live outside at the moment. We are on the look out for property with a good-sized multi-car garage (or cathouse, as a certain contributor to the forum calls it.......we wonder if the alternative connotation of that term (stateside) is realised!). Alternatively, we often joke, a multi-car garage with a shed attached for us to live in, would be an alternative.

The gentleman from whom we bought our S took delivery of a new F-Pace (can be seen in the background of my member pic). He was well struck, although he wishes he had gone for the larger engine to match the top of the range (sizewise) alloys which he ordered. F-Pace (or F-type) v Volvo..............hmmm!!!! Or even the latest E-Pace??

MOH (my significant other) once owned a Series 2 XJ6; he did enjoy it (from 1985 to 2003) but says that, as it was a '78 model, its BL era build quality was a bit dire (no, I'm not going to get into that discussion!). A good dry state 6 or 12, particularly the lovely Series 3, would be grand. MOH also once owned a '65 S-type (the original S-type shape) and that was his first trip into Jaguar land. Any thoughts of an E-type were more like Lala Land! Although he did once know a BL Executive who turned up with one of the very first V-12 E-types; at that time MOH ran a '72 Chrysler Charger 770 Coupe which handled like a barge and was no match for the E-type.

We shall await the decision between the F-Pace etc and the C30.........good luck!

As always, happy growling and here's one to make you drool some more......

MiragePro · January 20, 2018

Ron, it sounds as if you have been around to the block a few time when it comes to cars. My brother purchased a BSA 650 lightning here in the states. He took a road trip to California from Seattle. When he got back he complained how sore he was due to the vibrations and traded it in for a Honda 750.

Back in the early 70's I was working for Panasonic and putting a lot of miles on my 71 Capri. When I went to trade it in for a new one the Capri's were not out yet, and that is how I ended up with the Mustang ii. The ford dealer was across the street. The truck had just rolled in with their first delivery of the Mustangs and they gave me this sales pitch about how it was German designed and the suspension was from Mercedes. By the time I learned it was just a Ford pinto it was too late.

In the three years I had the Capri I had put over a 100k miles on it with no problems. That is something you Brits can be proud of. Even though it was built in Germany it had the British 1600-cc Kent crossflow engine. In 72 I had to go to Chicago for the CES show and decided to take the wife and drive from Seattle. Back then there were not speed limits in the state of Montana. On flat out stretches I could cruise at 120 mph on long stretches. Great little car and engine.

bonny68 · September 21

Hello-is there anyone in the Palm Springs area that would like to do a meet-up? I would like to get some Jag owners together to discuss issues, and also socialize for fun! Let me know-Thanks-Bonnie