FUEL FILLER COVER NOT LOCKING

[Wrinkly]

I have just discovered that the cover over my fuel filler cap is not automatically locking as I believe it should.

Have checked which fuse acts on this and it is F46 BOX C, in the luggage compartment. This fuse also acts with Boot Lid release and Interior Lights, both of which are working. When the fuel cover switch (in front of your Right knee) is pressed to release the cover I can hear what I assume is a solenoid working. 

I am now wondering why the lock is not working at this rather important time of supposed fuel delivery problems.

Because I can hear a noise at the cover when the open switch is pressed is this a definite sound of the solenoid working or not. Being as there is a noise I am at this stage assuming the solenoid is working. Is it possible that a part is missing from the actual part of the cover that locks into the locking device. That part looks as though it is plastic and I wonder if some piece (presumably  a metal of some sort ) has fallen off and become lost on a forecourt somewhere.

Sorry to be so vague but my knowledge of electronics is almost non existent.

Any advice/suggestion/knowledge would be gratefully received.   Regards and Best Wishes, John

[Chidders]

Just taken the below photos of my filler cap with the flap open hope it helps

[Wrinkly]

1 hour ago, Chidders said:

Just taken the below photos of my filler cap with the flap open hope it helps

David

Many thanks for your photos. The photo of the flap itself is identical to how mine looks. However the other photo, showing where the flap locks into is different. Yours is showing two fine pieces of metal that are folded behind a plastic lug of some sort. I believe my unit shows two pieces of fine metal but they are protruding outwards and not behind a lug. This may well be the problem, it looks as though the referred to lug is missing on mine. I have just taken (in pouring rain) two photos of my fitment (mimicking yours) and would post them on here if I knew how to

Thanks very much and Best Wishes, Regards John

[Wrinkly]

1 hour ago, Wrinkly said:

David

Many thanks for your photos. The photo of the flap itself is identical to how mine looks. However the other photo, showing where the flap locks into is different. Yours is showing two fine pieces of metal that are folded behind a plastic lug of some sort. I believe my unit shows two pieces of fine metal but they are protruding outwards and not behind a lug. This may well be the problem, it looks as though the referred to lug is missing on mine. I have just taken (in pouring rain) two photos of my fitment (mimicking yours) and would post them on here if I knew how to

Thanks very much and Best Wishes, Regards John

 

[Wrinkly]

It seems that there could be one of two different types of release actuator fitted to my car. I therefore intend removing the unit to identify which one it is.

However I have a concern that the photos I was kindly sent by Forum member Chidders shows the two fine metal clips being retained within the filler neck unit, where as on my car they are now not retained in the filler neck unit but are poking towards the outside flap/cover.(  See Photos of both above. )

Is this status because the actuator has broken and how do I get the clips back to where the photo of the correct lock shows? OR is there something else that needs attention / correction. 

I have located both different styles of actuator but am reluctant to by until I have firstly identified the correct part of the two, and secondly that someone has advise/commented on the positioning of the fine metal clips (as I have called them).

Your urgent help would be gratefully appreciated.  Best Wishes and Regards, John

[Cabernet02]

Hi

Sorry to butt in here - but to me the issue is most likely the 'Locking Pin' actuated by the solenoid is actually stuck inside the housing on yours but on Johns its clearly visible - red arrow in photo;

My other comment is that attempts to open or close the cover it has picked up and bent the metal springs which are used to spring the door open once the solenoid pin has been retracted.

I think with some gentle pressing to reform their shape - you should be able to push the springs back into the housing.

I had a problem with mine not closing once opened and a good squirt of 3 in 1 Oil on to the locking pin (arrow in red) and several presses of the button in the car to actuate the solenoid freed it up perfectly. I continued to press at least a dozen times and added more Oil. 

I hope this helps and that you don't have to remove the whole mechanism.

Good Luck

[Cabernet02]

Got the name the wrong way their - sorry I meant on Davids car. DOH!

[Wrinkly]

Thank you very much for your observation and advice. I was just about to go out side and attempt to remove the actuator. I shall now go down the route you have suggested before removing anything and hopefully avoiding unnecessary work and may be even costs.

 

Much appreciated and Best Wishes, Regards, John

[Wrinkly]

Well the Oil and pressing the release switch has certainly freed something up. However it now looks that the little black button is not on the end of the actuator arm. as I can see a very small spring like thing in view. Photo herewith.

Also I still cannot figure out what is supposed to hold the two thin metal clips back in place. There dose not appear to be anywhere to hold them in place????

Looks like I shall have to go and attempt to remove the actuator unit.

 

Many thanks and Best Wishes. John

 

[Cabernet02]

Hi John

Well i think the pin has waved goodby for whatever reason - its certainly not there now?

Re the metal springs - if you look deeper at the foot of the image you posted you can see it is simply a U shaped spring but in your case the shape is distorted with the legs bent out from the original shape. I think you just need to tease them back to the proper shape by say pressing home with a flat blade screw driver until the are bent back.

Of course this may not be be necessary if your replacing the mechanism anyway. Your coloured door should pop of the old mechanism onto the new one.

I actually broke my door clean of on my old jag but the use of a 2 part epoxy called Liquid Metal or something like that fixed it for good. the repair was way easier than removal of the mechanism.

Again good luck

All the best

Peter (not old Peter)

[Wrinkly]

Peter

I am considering a complete new fuel filler neck, which are a bit expensive. If the U shaped springs will bend back into place it may not be necessary. I have spent an hour and a half this morning, got wet and frozen attempting to get at the actuator so as to identify which model of a possible two it is. Due to being frozen and wet I gave up and am hoping I can get my son in law to come to my rescue at some time.

In the meanwhile thanks for all of your help and advice. Best wishes and Regards, John

[Wrinkly]

Actuator now removed and Identified which replacement type I need. Has been ordered and now await delivery and then fitment.

 

Many thanks to all members involved in advice/suggestions/photos.

Regards and Best Wishes to all, John

[Cabernet02]

Morning John

Well that sounded easier than I imagined it to be! I am glad you are sorted with the spares. I searched the Jaguar Workshop manual pdf for for more help and out of the 3000+ pages I found no mechanical reference to it at all? it is quite a comprehensive file and if you use it on a PC with Adobe Acrobat or similar - it is searchable. not sure if you have a copy but its free from many places or if you private message me i can send you a copy. 

cabernet02@hotmail.co.uk

Did you order from Jaguar or a dismantlers?

Best wishes

Peter

[Wrinkly]

Peter

The removal was not easy, or more to the point is in a very awkward and hard to access place.

I do have a CD of the Jaguar Workshop manual and likewise I searched looking for information and also found nothing was forthcoming. For the sake of urgency I have purchases from a dismantler who had been very helpful to me in identifying where/how to get to the Actuator . The only fault on the removed Actuator is that a very small piece of the end black push bar has broken off. I will at least have a spare that I can fiddle with if ever necessary, as it could well be possible, if one had the patience, to rebuild this end piece. At almost 72 years I am (unfortunately) not known for my patience with fiddly little things like this. However I am not chancing it for the sake of £25.

Many thanks for your help and continued interest in the outcome.

Best Wishes and Regards, John

[Jimbov8]

This TSB may be of interest to you.

http://www.jagrepair.com/images/TSB/TSB2/S-Type/310Fuel/S310-06 Fuel Filler Door Inoperative.pdf

[Wrinkly]

Jim

Many thanks, looks as though these have been subject to warranty in the past. Drawing one: the part does not exist on my replacement part. However Drawing two: the part does exist on my replacement part. Was going to fit this part tomorrow so will check again before doing so.

Thank you, Best Wishes and Regards, John

[Wrinkly]

Actuator replaced this morning and everything working as it should.

Many thanks to all who have been involved with this fix.

Best Wishes and Regards, John

[Cabernet02]

Hi John

Fuel door fixed - now where to try it out ha ha...

Well done on your DIY skills - I am 10yrs your jnr and I too can get impatient doing things on the car but I try to keep my cool as impatience just breaks things and creates more for you have to fix.

All the best

Peter

[Wrinkly]

1 hour ago, Cabernet02 said:

Hi John

Fuel door fixed - now where to try it out ha ha...

Well done on your DIY skills - I am 10yrs your jnr and I too can get impatient doing things on the car but I try to keep my cool as impatience just breaks things and creates more for you have to fix.

All the best

Peter

Peter

How true your comments on patience are. This job was really fiddly and somewhat time consuming but I hope it proves successful. Some 40/50 test actions to open the door flap were successful so I am contemplating it will stay that way.

Best Wishes, John

[AdyP]

Hello,

I'm a little to this i'm afraid. I have exactly the same issue. The motor is working when you press the button but there is only a spring evident, no pin to hold the cap shut. Do i have to replace the whole thing and is it accessed from the boot?

[Wrinkly]

5 hours ago, AdyP said:

Hello,

I'm a little to this i'm afraid. I have exactly the same issue. The motor is working when you press the button but there is only a spring evident, no pin to hold the cap shut. Do i have to replace the whole thing and is it accessed from the boot?

You will have to replace the actuator. I managed to find a good second hand one from a breaker who was very good and it arrived the following day. Yes it is accessed from in the boot. On the right hand side (offside).. Remove the finishing panels and you will see a rather strong looking bracket that on mine is coloured Black. Remove this black bracket and the attached electronics and with a bit of fiddling you can get your hand up in their to find two bolts holding in the actuator. Both need undoing but only one is necessary to take out. The other one slides out of a slot it fits into. The actuator can then be pulled out.

One further but important thing, I established that there could be one of two different actuators on my car. I had to get the old one out first so as to establish which of the two I needed.

It is very fiddly and needs a lot of patience. I achieved it and I am not known for my patience with fiddling with awkward things in awkward places. 

If you need to , do not be afraid to get back to me.

 

Best Wishes and Good Luck, Regards, John